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peatbogger
Specialist Specialist
Posted on 24-08-2018 at 02:08 am

Jim Murray is the rock star of whisky to the new whisky drinker (at least in North America anyways) and when Jim rates whiskies like he does; mundane in the 90-95 and good to not-so great in the 96 & up range, this may explain the rampant of high ratings here on WB.


I'm not includung Canada, but for some reason Americans have a hard time recognizing con men and corruption. It may be the idolizing glamour; if you're in the spotlight, you're a guru to be followed. Combine that with Jim's audacity to call his publication "The Bible".

We all believe The Bible, don't we? Whisky is only 6.000 years old and Noah brought two bottles from each distillery on to the ark.


Bought a bottle of Ardbeg An Oa not long ago. Affordable for an Ardbeg.

But I almost put it back on the shelf when I noticed a sticker on the box: Jim Murray's Whisky Bible: 95,5 points.

Come on... seriously... I mean... 95,5 points for a £40 bottle of core range Ardbeg NAS. Who falls for that crap of marketing?

Knowing Jim has (or at least had) a financial interest in Ardbeg, I thought Jim's 95 is my 85, so I figured it was still worth the price.

Looks like my Murray correction factor is a bit low, it's rated an average of 83,86 by 466 votes.

It's not as bad as you think. On this bottle only 0,6% agree or superceed Jim in their rating.

Still I agree with you, he does more bad than good for the discerning consumer.

peatbogger
Specialist Specialist
Posted on 24-08-2018 at 03:44 am

VaryingViewpoint wrote:

I know Whisky Barrel has made more than one appearance here already. However they've earned the right to be here for as many times they earn the distinction at being the best at trying to lift prices to new heights.  Here is a perfect example; Springbank 21-year-old https://www.whiskybase.com/whiskies/whisky/84230/21-year-old There are already 4 available (not that hard to find) to purchase in the WB market place with a price range of €475,00 - € 675,00, if that is not already on the high side there is Whisky Barrel with the only online link asking  £899,99 which seems to me obscene; nothing extra special about this particular release, yes it's cask strength with a limit of 702 bottles, but I believe this is annual release from Springbank. If you missed it at retail last year get the next release instead.

This thread could be re-named "Whisky Barrel shamed".


I beg to differ.

In the price bracket you quote; yes they are at the top. 

But for general new releases around and below the £100 mark, they are on par or below the average.

They practice the same policy as I ranted about on the Danish shop Juul's, which was defended by mrgood and to some degree elaborated on here as well.

As the shop stock for a bottle with limited availability to restock decrease, they raise the price accordingly regardless of offers from other shops, knowing they soon will be the last option.

This is more or less unique to whisky, as most other consumable commodities goes on sale when stock is getting low, to clear space for new inventory.

A year ago I bought a few newly released GM Connoisseur Choice bottles from them. Both really affordable and great value at the time. £32 for a Teaninich and £28 for an Arran, both 2007 vintages.

Looking at them now, the same bottles are both priced at £99,95.

Definitely not worth that much and with several shop links still showing around £45.

I agree with mrgood, as a customer you have a choise to buy or not.

My problem with this is that after all other sources are depleted and shop links removed, some nitwit will come along and buy it anyway. Thinking they made a bargain on a rare bottle, when in fact they paid 3 times the value of an average bottle.

I can't blame a shop for pricing it's inventory according to what people are willing to pay.

But I can blame ignorant people willing to over pay and in that manner cause an escalating inflation where there should not be a need for it.

As a foreign customer I find Whisky Barrel to be amazing. They deduct UK VAT for shipping outside EU and charge a minimal shipping fee.

Their web shop is up to date and accurate. I've ordered more than 20 bottles from their site the last year, everything delivered at the door, usually within 48 hours. Unlike my local store, where 3 out of 5 orders have been canceled due to incorrect logistics, and those that I did get took 8-10 days before the prepaid order could be picked up at the store.

The 20+ bottles I have bought from them have cost me less than half of what I would have had to pay if they were available locally, and hundreds of £ less than the average WB value.

And why chase those hyped bottle releases you know will be in high demand?

For my latest order I got two more bottles of a first fill sherry SC CS that I scored 94 points for £86 each. Bottles that would have been priced £180-200 locally.

Sweeeeet happy

  Edited on 24-08-2018 at 03:52 am
VaryingViewpoint
Moderator Moderator
Posted on 24-08-2018 at 06:27 am

peatbogger wrote:

VaryingViewpoint wrote:

I know Whisky Barrel has made more than one appearance here already. However they've earned the right to be here for as many times they earn the distinction at being the best at trying to lift prices to new heights.  Here is a perfect example; Springbank 21-year-old https://www.whiskybase.com/whiskies/whisky/84230/21-year-old There are already 4 available (not that hard to find) to purchase in the WB market place with a price range of €475,00 - € 675,00, if that is not already on the high side there is Whisky Barrel with the only online link asking  £899,99 which seems to me obscene; nothing extra special about this particular release, yes it's cask strength with a limit of 702 bottles, but I believe this is annual release from Springbank. If you missed it at retail last year get the next release instead.

This thread could be re-named "Whisky Barrel shamed".


I beg to differ.

In the price bracket you quote; yes they are at the top. 

But for general new releases around and below the £100 mark, they are on par or below the average.


I stand corrected! 

It should be called "The Whisky Shop Singapore shamed" They take the cake by a wide margin.

Look at these;

€ 114779,85  for Bowmore 1964 Black https://www.whiskybase.com/whiskies/whisky/8341/bowmore-1964-black

€ 1500,91 for a Bowmore 10yo The Devil's Casks Batch II https://www.whiskybase.com/whiskies/whisky/56174/bowmore-10-year-old

If you real want to throw-up look at their website https://www.thewhiskyshop.com.sg/collections/all?sort_by=price-descending a little pop-up "Chat with us" is there for you to share your thoughts. If you're so inclined.

One life... Drink it well
peatbogger
Specialist Specialist
Posted on 24-08-2018 at 13:16 pm

peatbogger wrote:

I stand corrected! 

It should be called "The Whisky Shop Singapore shamed" They take the cake by a wide margin.

Ah,Singapore, then I understand.


Found a picture of the owner.

Ass


Ancient
Expert Senior Senior Expert
Posted on 26-08-2018 at 20:39 pm

VaryingViewpoint wrote:

peatbogger wrote:

VaryingViewpoint wrote:

I know Whisky Barrel has made more than one appearance here already. However they've earned the right to be here for as many times they earn the distinction at being the best at trying to lift prices to new heights.  Here is a perfect example; Springbank 21-year-old https://www.whiskybase.com/whiskies/whisky/84230/21-year-old There are already 4 available (not that hard to find) to purchase in the WB market place with a price range of €475,00 - € 675,00, if that is not already on the high side there is Whisky Barrel with the only online link asking  £899,99 which seems to me obscene; nothing extra special about this particular release, yes it's cask strength with a limit of 702 bottles, but I believe this is annual release from Springbank. If you missed it at retail last year get the next release instead.

This thread could be re-named "Whisky Barrel shamed".


I beg to differ.

In the price bracket you quote; yes they are at the top. 

But for general new releases around and below the £100 mark, they are on par or below the average.


I stand corrected! 

It should be called "The Whisky Shop Singapore shamed" They take the cake by a wide margin.

Look at these;

€ 114779,85  for Bowmore 1964 Black https://www.whiskybase.com/whiskies/whisky/8341/bowmore-1964-black

€ 1500,91 for a Bowmore 10yo The Devil's Casks Batch II https://www.whiskybase.com/whiskies/whisky/56174/bowmore-10-year-old

If you real want to throw-up look at their website https://www.thewhiskyshop.com.sg/collections/all?sort_by=price-descending a little pop-up "Chat with us" is there for you to share your thoughts. If you're so inclined.


Though I absolutely love that image of the man with his head up his ass, and for what it is worth: I live in the SF area of the USA. I have made a few purchases from Whisky Barrel over the years. In each case, the Whisky I got was cheaper, inclusive of express shipping, than I can get it hear in the US - even from K&L, which is a great retailer that has some of the best prices for whisky that I have found in the US. On the other hand, I have seem some of the prices at Whisky Barrel that are almost 2 times what the same whisky sells for here at K&L. I think it is a matter of smart shopping and price comparisons. I don't understand the mystery of pricing, but have seen so much variabilty that it is hard to generalize.


Ancient
VaryingViewpoint
Moderator Moderator
Posted on 01-06-2019 at 21:49 pm

I know Macallan is the standard-barrier when it comes to this topic, but, I think that they out did themselves on this one; Macallan Edition No.3 / with Glass & Aroma Diffuser https://www.whiskyauctioneer.com/lot/184512/macallan-edition-no3-glass-aroma-diffuser?s=5badfbd193d34 

A Macallan Aroma Diffuser. Really? 

I wonder when the Macallan coffee grinder and coffee maker combo is due to come out?

One life... Drink it well
mrgood
Expert Junior Junior Expert
Posted on 02-06-2019 at 18:42 pm

I know Macallan is the standard-barrier when it comes to this topic, but, I think that they out did themselves on this one; Macallan Edition No.3 / with Glass & Aroma Diffuser https://www.whiskyauctioneer.com/lot/184512/macallan-edition-no3-glass-aroma-diffuser?s=5badfbd193d34 

A Macallan Aroma Diffuser. Really? 

I wonder when the Macallan coffee grinder and coffee maker combo is due to come out?

Is that last picture on the instructions them tossing the whisky?  ha ha, oh yeah, Macallan would love that.  "don't even bother drinking this, just dump it down the sink, then go buy another bottle"

  Edited on 02-06-2019 at 18:42 pm
VaryingViewpoint
Moderator Moderator
Posted on 02-06-2019 at 19:39 pm

Bunnahabhain is following in the footsteps of the great single malt marketing masterssuch as Macallan, Delmore and the like. 

Here are a few of examples; 

Bunnahabhain 1980 Canasta Cask Finish 36yo non cask strength (I believe) https://www.whiskybase.com/whiskies/whisky/98484/bunnahabhain-1980 I mean really $3500+cnd for a finished release?

Then there is the Bunnahabhain 40-year-old https://www.whiskybase.com/whiskies/whisky/106625/bunnahabhain-40-year-old with a very low 41.9 % abv again probably not even cask strength. 

And finally the holy grail of over priced marketing Bunnahabhain's the 46 Year Old Eich Bhana Lìr https://www.whiskybase.com/whiskies/whisky/93201/bunnahabhain-eich-bhana-lr at over $10,000cnd. 

No value for the money there, except as trophies to gaze at on the shelf.

One life... Drink it well
mrgood
Expert Junior Junior Expert
Posted on 02-06-2019 at 20:14 pm

VaryingViewpoint wrote:

Bunnahabhain is following in the footsteps of the great single malt marketing masterssuch as Macallan, Delmore and the like. 

Here are a few of examples; 

Bunnahabhain 1980 Canasta Cask Finish 36yo non cask strength (I believe) https://www.whiskybase.com/whiskies/whisky/98484/bunnahabhain-1980 I mean really $3500+cnd for a finished release?

Then there is the Bunnahabhain 40-year-old https://www.whiskybase.com/whiskies/whisky/106625/bunnahabhain-40-year-old with a very low 41.9 % abv again probably not even cask strength. 

And finally the holy grail of over priced marketing Bunnahabhain's the 46 Year Old Eich Bhana Lìr https://www.whiskybase.com/whiskies/whisky/93201/bunnahabhain-eich-bhana-lr at over $10,000cnd. 

No value for the money there, except as trophies to gaze at on the shelf.

I have to defend Bunnahabhain a little bit here because I feel they're one of the distilleries  least deserving to be on this list.  They were leading the charge on doing things right.  Standard range unchilfiltered, natural colour, higher ABV, one of the more reasonably priced brands (relatively speaking)... and pretty good quality to boot.  If they keep their regular stuff like that I have no problem whatsoever with them popping a few crazy special releases to take advantage of the fools.

The 40yr price is disappointing, but again I can hardly blame them for giving it a valuation in a range that people seem willing to pay.  Better the distillery gets it than bottle flippers.

VaryingViewpoint
Moderator Moderator
Posted on 03-06-2019 at 06:50 am

mrgood wrote:

VaryingViewpoint wrote:

Bunnahabhain is following in the footsteps of the great single malt marketing masterssuch as Macallan, Delmore and the like. 

Here are a few of examples; 

Bunnahabhain 1980 Canasta Cask Finish 36yo non cask strength (I believe) https://www.whiskybase.com/whiskies/whisky/98484/bunnahabhain-1980 I mean really $3500+cnd for a finished release?

Then there is the Bunnahabhain 40-year-old https://www.whiskybase.com/whiskies/whisky/106625/bunnahabhain-40-year-old with a very low 41.9 % abv again probably not even cask strength. 

And finally the holy grail of over priced marketing Bunnahabhain's the 46 Year Old Eich Bhana Lìr https://www.whiskybase.com/whiskies/whisky/93201/bunnahabhain-eich-bhana-lr at over $10,000cnd. 

No value for the money there, except as trophies to gaze at on the shelf.

I have to defend Bunnahabhain a little bit here because I feel they're one of the distilleries  least deserving to be on this list.  They were leading the charge on doing things right.  Standard range unchilfiltered, natural colour, higher ABV, one of the more reasonably priced brands (relatively speaking)... and pretty good quality to boot.  If they keep their regular stuff like that I have no problem whatsoever with them popping a few crazy special releases to take advantage of the fools.

The 40yr price is disappointing, but again I can hardly blame them for giving it a valuation in a range that people seem willing to pay.  Better the distillery gets it than bottle flippers.

"They were leading the charge on doing things right. Standard range unchilfiltered, natural colour, higher ABV, one of the more reasonably priced brands (relatively speaking)... and pretty good quality to boot." 

I was of the same mindset about them as you, but, I believe "were" is the operative word when it comes to Bunnahabhain today. IMHO.

For me Bunnahabhain has fallen out of favour over the last 4 years, and especially with their new core range releases as of late. Yes they still do offer "unchilfiltered, natural colour, higher ABV" in most if not all their releases. However, I've heard these new core range releases that hit store shelves in the past 12-18 months are not up to their old standards of the past (let alone being any better). Although I personally will not purchase any chill-filtered and/or less than 46 abv releases (unless it's cask strength) I do not look to Bunnahabhain as a value purchase anymore. Hence me pointing out just some of their higher priced releases which, to me, lack substance in quality at such high prices.

  Edited on 03-06-2019 at 15:45 pm
One life... Drink it well
lincolnimp
Connoisseur Connoisseur
Posted on 15-06-2019 at 14:46 pm

https://www.htfw.com/secret-speyside-john-crabbie-limited-edition-single-malt-25-year-old

`This is Hard To Find Whisky's investment tip for 2019 - get it while you can`

That line on the website, really pissed me off.

Bart&Claudia
Expert Junior Junior Expert
Posted on 17-06-2019 at 22:09 pm

Just mental. 50 pounds in TR. Boycot this clown. 

https://www.whiskybase.com/market/whisky/97266

VaryingViewpoint
Moderator Moderator
Posted on 11-05-2020 at 03:21 am

Richard Paterson. 

I'm sure his name has been mentioned on this topic before, but, this is being posted because of the BS that he spews as he answers a question from a Delmore fan about chilled-filtration at the 1:15min mark; WhiskyCast HD: 50 Years of Whisky Blending with Richard Paterson (Part 2) 17min https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9RYz8tw-Nvo 

The depth of his BS answer is really something.

One life... Drink it well
ahroeen
Expert Senior Senior Expert
Posted on 12-05-2020 at 22:28 pm

VaryingViewpoint wrote:

Richard Paterson. 

I'm sure his name has been mentioned on this topic before, but, this is being posted because of the BS that he spews as he answers a question from a Delmore fan about chilled-filtration at the 1:15min mark; WhiskyCast HD: 50 Years of Whisky Blending with Richard Paterson (Part 2) 17min https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9RYz8tw-Nvo 

The depth of his BS answer is really something.


That was painful. I mean; he's asked a question about Dalmore's usually low abv and chill-filtration, and his first thought is to mention the Constellation series as a counter-example...?


I can understand the market Paterson and Dalmore are aiming at (hint: it's not us), but it hurts that this is what people understand as high-end, exclusive whisky.

Alcohol can be a good friend, but a bad master. - Christopher Hitchens
mrgood
Expert Junior Junior Expert
Posted on 13-05-2020 at 01:10 am

VaryingViewpoint wrote:

Richard Paterson. 

I'm sure his name has been mentioned on this topic before, but, this is being posted because of the BS that he spews as he answers a question from a Delmore fan about chilled-filtration at the 1:15min mark; WhiskyCast HD: 50 Years of Whisky Blending with Richard Paterson (Part 2) 17min https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9RYz8tw-Nvo 

The depth of his BS answer is really something.

"Canada"?!  don't drag us into it you rat bastard.  We know cloudy whisky means nothing in regards to quality. in fact, cloudiness is a good sign because it means you haven't mucked with it...  and besides, the cloudiness argument is irrelevant when your bottles are too dark to see the whisky inside, and if you bottled at reasonable ABV it wouldn't get cloudy anyway.

I was disgusted with the arrogance of  his answer, until he started talking about Constellations in a conversation about the 12yr.  ha ha ha, oh, i see, he's just having a laugh.

"Dalmore fans".  those exist?  happy

  Edited on 13-05-2020 at 01:11 am
VaryingViewpoint
Moderator Moderator
Posted on 13-05-2020 at 06:32 am

mrgood wrote:

VaryingViewpoint wrote:

Richard Paterson. 

I'm sure his name has been mentioned on this topic before, but, this is being posted because of the BS that he spews as he answers a question from a Delmore fan about chilled-filtration at the 1:15min mark; WhiskyCast HD: 50 Years of Whisky Blending with Richard Paterson (Part 2) 17min https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9RYz8tw-Nvo 

The depth of his BS answer is really something.

"Canada"?!  don't drag us into it you rat bastard.  We know cloudy whisky means nothing in regards to quality. in fact, cloudiness is a good sign because it means you haven't mucked with it...  and besides, the cloudiness argument is irrelevant when your bottles are too dark to see the whisky inside, and if you bottled at reasonable ABV it wouldn't get cloudy anyway.

I was disgusted with the arrogance of  his answer, until he started talking about Constellations in a conversation about the 12yr.  ha ha ha, oh, i see, he's just having a laugh.

"Dalmore fans".  those exist?  happy

I find his explanation on Canada being cold as the reason for not wanting non-chilled-filtered shipped up here the most retarded thing one can say. In his mind he is saying all non-chilled-filtered whisky that enters the cold climate of Canada and parts of the US turns cloudy. Really! Not by adding water, it's all in the temperature? I guess that goes for all the non-Dalmore non-chilled-filtered release as well. All my Aberlour A'bunadh, Lagavulin, Octomore's are cloudy then???

And then he says that the more matured (older) whiskies are somehow "naturally" chilled-filtered on their own in the warehouses. WOW!

  Edited on 13-05-2020 at 06:35 am
One life... Drink it well
GTATurbo
Member Senior Senior Member
Posted on 16-05-2020 at 08:54 am

Pretty new to the forum and haven't read through this entire thread, but has anyone mentioned Dekanta yet? Price gouge central! Does anyone ever actually buy from them?

Irish Whiskey Lover, but like all whisky My Collection
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